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theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 17 Oct 2015 22:56
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Hello all!

I've been reading your postings for a little while now, and I finally thought it would be a good idea to sign up and join in the discussion(s)!

I hope you don't mind if I explain my situation a little bit and ask for some advice. I'd greatly appreciate it.

The situation is this. 2-storey house, end-terrace. North facing. Approx 3 mobile phone masts to the north of the house, at least 1 in line of sight from my bedroom. Not sure on the distances of these, but the closest could be about 75+ metres I suppose. Neighbour next door (to the east) has (to my knowledge) Wi-Fi router in the bedroom (more fool him), which adjoins my bedroom and means that the router is on the other side of the connecting wall. I believe there are DECT phones in the house though unsure of location, and has recently told me that the CCTV cameras he has installed (don't ask) are wireless, and one is quite close to our outside wall, which is where my bedroom starts. I'm sorry if I've not explained this well.

I completely freaked out in July when I started reading up on EMFs and microwaves. I quickly ditched Wi-Fi and my mobile phone, much to the amazement of family and friends. At the same time I ordered Blocpaint (which I hope is an admirable substitute for YSheild which I found on Amazon, and was cheaper), and bought a grounding kit. I only used the paint a week ago as I hesitated for a long time whether it was the right thing to do.

I'm low on funds. Before I painted I didn't invest in a meter (which I feel stupid for now), though I did check the neighbour's signal strength with my (no longer used) smartphone, but again I didn't do this properly. I know that my bedroom registered 2 out of 4 bars of signal for their Wi-Fi, and sometimes 1 out of 4 but never less. I applied a single coat of Blocpaint to the adjoining wall, covering the skirtings and a bit of the ceiling. I then grounded the paint (so I did this backwards), by placing a piece of conductive tape on the wall, drilling the plate through the conductive tape, then painting a bit extra over that tape to 'connect' it to the wall. The earthing wire is connected to a 3-point plug that I have plugged in. This was then covered with 3 coats of emulsion. One part of the wall wasn't covered where there's an old fireplace (it's an old house!)

I'm sorry this is so long and rambling. After I painted, the Wi-Fi signal is barely visible. I've only started checking the dBm levels, and it's way down, -90s and less, and often the Wi-Fi network is not visible. I finally gave in and bought a Cornet ED78S which arrived this morning, and I'm in a panic again.

I can't believe the noise which, having identified it, is coming from the mobile phone masts, which one I don't know. In my room, levels vary from about 0.01V/m (as low as the reader seems to go), to up to 0.06-0.08 V/m (I have seen 0.1 V/m) in certain, very specific areas close to but not directly against the adjoining wall. These are quite close to the head of my bed. Strangely, there is a spot close to the middle of the ceiling in the room which registers about the same. There seems to be higher readings at a certain angle from the window which faces the north, and the masts. When the window is shut, signals are definitely lower. When I've put the meter out the window, I've easily gotten 0.2 V/m and at a certain angle in the room when the window is open, I've gotten 0.12 V/m. Otherwise, the room averages around 0.02-0.05 V/m. In rooms to the back of the house, the meter bottoms out, as it does downstairs except in the hall, which must be in line of sight of a mast as it goes bazerk, with readings as high as those out my window and higher! When I put the sound on the meter, at any time, all I hear is that whine, some mobile noise (intermittent pulsing) and a bit of DECT. I can't hear Wi-Fi ticking.

I guess my questions are: is it likely, considering what I've said, that I have reduced emissions from next door, even though I didn't meter them before? Is it at all possible though that painting that wall means that mobile mast signals are reflected and enhanced in the room, and I've made things worse? I feel 'different' since I've done the painting that's for sure. It's hard to know what to make of it, as I've had mental health issues for a long time and my moods vary considerably. Though I feel clearer, I am quite tired at the moment, since I've painted, though I don't feel half as agitated as I used to.

Am I going to have to sheild the window and the north-facing wall (which would be a pain)? Should I be concerned about the levels I'm getting in the bedroom, when downstairs like I say, the readings often bottom out (except outside!) In the other front-facing bedroom levels can be similar to mine, but generally I think my room is higher. Is this because of next door, because the signal is still coming in? I only did one coat, there's of course the matter of the floorboards and the ceiling not being covered etc., and the router is right on the other side of the wall. I wish I'd gotten a meter before I did this, but I couldn't afford it. I've only been able to get one now, and I was desperate to get the signals reduced as cheaply as I could. I thought what I was doing was fine, but now I'm not so sure. And plugging in the grounding cable seems to make very little difference.

I know I'm an idiot. I'm sorry. Whatever advice or opinions you've got would be greatly appreciated. I've become very frightened about EMFs, especially after hearing them for myself with my meter. It's unbelievable. I thought the Wi-Fi was my biggest problem (and the DECT, and the wireless CCTV) but now I think it might be the masts.

Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post.

agnes
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 01:35
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Hi The Lone Ranger.
I am truly glad you contacted us. and I feel confident that many of Forums users will replay and quote what works for them, and honestly it is worth giving it a try, their advice is build on Experience on their or their families own bodies and their health issues.
No way, are you deranged, paranoid or anything like it.
And please stop saying sorry!
The reason for this setting up this website in 2005 was to try to help Others, in a similar position as We were confronted with, and who experienced similar health effects as we did when a 3 Mobile mast was installed only 28 meters away from our lovely (former) home and place of work.
I do not know if the health effects of Artificial "Electromagnetic Microwave Radiation" (EMR for short) produced by the Mobile phone Industry has affected you yet, you don't say, but you are scared, and that is what counts.

I have no idea in which country you are, Terraced house sounds like the UK though, but is it possible for you to send us a link to the "Blocpaint" you have used?
I have searched, and have not found anything that is remotely like Yshield,
only paint on walls that you can paint in blocks, without seams to when you paint the next block.
I looked up your meter which comes from Electro-sence, Lloyd Burrel, who is a very old friend of mine.
But I have no experience of Lloyd's Meters, and as I live in the Uk ours come from Sensory Perspective: http://www.perspective.co.uk/shop/index.php?app=gbu0&ns=brandshow&ref=Sensory
Who manufacture the most low cost EMR monitors in the Uk, and believe you me they are good.
They have produced a "sound-cloud" where you can listen to the different sounds of microwave radiation, from the different sources.
Link: http://www.detect-protect.com/k/buzz/listen.htm
So, listen to the recording, and try to turn on your meter, and you should easily be able to determine what is what, and what you are being bombarded by.
Try this and get back to me, pls.
We are trying, against all odds, to fight this Environmental poisoning of entire world, but day by day it is getting worse .
Best regards.
Agnes

horsevad
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 12:56 - Edited by: horsevad
Reply 


Actually your are quite lucky if these readings reflects the overall exposure situation in a location 75 meters from an antenna mast.

There are two relevant scientifically grounded guidelines which you can choose to follow in regards to your shielding project.

Valid exposure guidelines:
Up to about 0.05 V/m (50mV/m) is accepted as "safe" in the BioInitative 2012 report.

The German Building Biologists use a different value in their SBM2008 Standard for Building Biology Measures, namely 0.0061 V/m (6.1mV/m).

If a person already has symptoms of EHS it is probably best to follow the SBM 2008 standard. If you do not suffer from EHS at present the BioInitaive guidelines should be enough to prevent EHS.

As such, the measurement values you have stated are in most places rather close to the relevant guidelines. As such it should be rather easy to accomplish your shielding project fully.

Gounding:

Grounding a faraday cage does not alter shielding effectiveness or shielding characteristics, but grounding can prevent re-radiation of RF-energy along the impedance difference lines in your shielding which would otherwise act as antennas. From a electrical safety perspective grounding is essential.

Blocpaint:
I have no first hand knowledge of this product, and the manufacturer does not provide any technical information on their website.

I have first hand experience with Yshield paints and can recommend their products.

That said, making a shielding paint should technically be rather easy, as it just amounts to adding some carbon to an emulsion paint - the tricky part is making it usable without adding to many ecologically unsuitable ingredients. A lot of EHS-sufferes also develops MCS, which means that the paint really should be as environmental low-impact as possible.


---

Don't hesitate to ask if you have further technical questions.

//Kim Horsevad

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 14:34
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Dear Agnes and Kim,

Many thanks for your replies.

I guessed the distance from the base station. Using maps and 'as the bird flies' measurements, I'm more like 300m.

The Blocpaint can be found here, http://shop.wireless-protection.org/blocpaint-wall-floor-and-ceiling-shielding-191-p. asp.

I had a look at the Detect & Protect sample sounds, and it sounds like most of the trouble is coming from the mast. I can't hear anything from next door (the WiFi router) though sometimes I wonder if I hear the DECT phones...

It's really frustrating as the front two bedrooms seem the highest. Outside incidentally is almost always higher or the same unless round the back of the house. Though I know this meter isn't particularly accurate. I feel like an idiot for applying the paint without getting a meter first. I feel like I've put the cart before the horse. I'm tempted to sand away some (if not all!) of the paint and see if I've actually made things worse by applying the paint to the east wall, whereas the masts etc. are to the north. This is my concern. Have I made things worse by 'sheilding' this one wall and I'm causing all the mast tower radiation to be reflected back into the room? Readings are higher when the windows are open...

The screeching sound from the mast is terrifying. It can be so loud. I'd never have realised what was going on unless I had this meter. Am I electrosensitive? The answer is I don't know. I may be. I've had a lot of problems since around the age I got a mobile phone (14 or so), and now I'm 28. So half my life I've used a mobile phone. I was an early adopter of Wi-Fi and wherever I went I took a router with me. I used my phone extensively. If anything, I'm terrified by what I've done to myself over the years. I've only been without Wi-Fi and mobile phone for about 3 months, and I have noticed a difference. I actually felt ill when I first stopped using my mobile phone. And now after I've applied the paint... I don't know. My moods vary considerably anyway and I've felt like this before now, but I am concerned that I've heightened radiation in the room. I'm half tempted to sand off all the paint, knowing now that I can (potentially!) mix some carbon in with normal paint another time and reapply that, as this sheilding paint is damn expensive and I could only afford to put on one layer. I couldn't really afford this meter if I'm honest... Though applying the paint the first time around was a right pain and it's made next-doors Wi-Fi barely visible, which I thought was the main problem as the router is at the head of my bed on the other side of the wall, and I can't really rearrange things.

I'm really at a loss what to do. I thought getting rid of Wi-Fi myself and my phone would be enough, now it seems like it's no where near. Though honestly the levels indoors, at their worst, and only in certain spots, are about 0.09 V/m and in this room they average around 0.03 V/m or so. So, that's not terrible. My concern is, have I made things worse by applying the paint to this one wall?

I just want to feel better. I'm really starting to wonder if I am electrosensitive. I can't bear being around Wi-Fi routers or anything like that now, and they're absolutely everywhere. It's like the world has gone mad. And frankly it's difficult without a mobile phone at my age as the expectation is that you've got one, and people think I'm absolutely insane. It also takes some getting used to on my part as I've had a phone half of my life and I find adjustment quite difficult.

Thanks again for all your help. You're very kind.

horsevad
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 15:47
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By your measurements it sounds like the paint is doing its job perfectly. From an health and safety perspective sanding the shielding paint away would require some rather extensive dust managing procedures and filtered air equipment for the person doing the sanding.

As such there seems to be no logical reason why one would sand the paint away.

What you need might be to shield the walls facing the mobile mast; though if you have readings of 0.03V/m you are already better off than a lot of people these days. By the information given it sounds that you actually are rather close to establishing a level of shielding capable of bringing exposure levels below BioInititive levels. This is good. Probably around 99% of the population lives the greater parts of their life in environments with significantly larger exposure values.

Cheap aluminium fly screen netting is a good way of shielding windows.

//Kim Horsevad

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 16:23
Reply 


Thank you for your reply Kim.

My main concern was that the paint would be reflecting back into the room signals coming from the north, as the paint was used on the east wall. It has definitely significantly lowered (and basically removed!) the Wi-Fi signal from next door. I've just been doing readings close to the north wall, and they are higher, up at around 0.07 V/m and higher sometimes. I'm guessing this is what the problem is, now... the masts to the north. It is an exposed brick wall and it would be a shame to paint over it, but I think that's what I'll have to do.

I don't expect perfection, but when the meter is practically silent in some parts of the house (including some living areas and the kitchen!) without any sheilding, and yet the meter is sometimes screaming in the bedroom, I'm not only astounded but also a bit saddened. The one place I could do without signals coming in is the place where they are coming in the most.

I'd be happy if I could get levels down to Bioinitiative levels, and I think painting the north facing wall will do it. Again, my big concern is turning the room into a EMF equivalent of a hall of mirrors, where any signals coming in are bounced around and attenuated because of the painting, thus making the work I've done futile and, like you say, making it practically impossible to safely remedy as this paint seems like a nightmare to remove. It would be impossible to remove it once painted onto exposed brickwork I am sure. Painting the exterior of the house is not an option, because of cost and the work involved, though I may try some aluminium foil as a trial and see whether it is indeed the wall in question before I take drastic painting measures.

I've looked for aluminium fly screen netting and have yet to find any. I shall continue searching though any recommendations would be gratefully received.

I love where I live and its not feasible for me to leave. What I simply can't believe is that these masts have been allowed to proliferate without any extensive testing. They're on the way to banning e-cigarettes because of 'potential harm'... what about these masts? It's because of two things I imagine: money, and because people can't 'see' the radiation. Until you get a meter. Then it really becomes terrifying.

I must be in direct line of sight of the mast to have high readings in the bedroom. And the walls are thick too. In an outbuilding, where readings are high outside, as soon as you step in there's nothing. I can't understand why that isn't the case with the house, where walls are just as thick. But as you say, I'm already at pretty reasonable levels. I feel sorry for people living close to these things.

A closing thought: a doctor recently suggested that 50% of us will get cancer and there's nothing we can do about it. Really. How ridiculous it is, in this modern age, that cancer should be such a problem, considering that we've drastically reduced smoking rates and, in general, air pollution levels. I am convinced that there is nothing natural about artificial, pulsed microwaves and, even if it turns out that they don't have significant health implications (though they might), the very nature of the waves is bound to influence our bodies one way or another.

Thank you for your help. Any further suggestions or insights are greatly appreciated.

horsevad
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 20:06
Reply 


Most people don't even consider the problems that can arise form unwanted reflections from shielding surfaces. You have actually grasped one of the key concepts in successful shielding.

It is quite normal to require paint on several walls to achieve sufficient attenuation - and to remove the possibility of unwanted reflections.

To make such shielding projects easier Yshield has actually added components to their paint such that the paint no only reflects but also absorbs. This technique to a large extent negates the possibility of unwanted reflections. The paint you have used might have the same characteristics, but as I mentioned earlier, the distributor has chosen not to make the technical details public.

//Kim Horsevad

ericgeneric
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 22:20
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Even if you've managed to figure out all this (and that's quite an achievement in itself), the shielding will only work so far, and if the radiation from the mast(s) gets stronger - as it inevitably will do, the phone companies can't help themselves - you may need to start all over again, or at least reassess what needs to be done to continue living without the health effects this technology is creating.

Readings and measurements are all well and good, but at the same time don't ignore or be oblivious to how you are feeling as time goes by. If you become sensitized, due to the proximity of the mast(s) - and 75m is close, very close - then you may well have no option but to find somewhere else to live.

(Welcome, by the way!).

EG.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 23:03
Reply 


Thank you Kim and Eric.

I chose Blocpaint because I could acquire it for a reasonable price. The reviews looked good too, and I was satisfied it was pretty much the same as YSheild. I'm not sure now.

I'm actually more like 300m from the mast. I was rubbish at guessing. I properly calculated it on a map and yes, it seems I'm about 300m away. That's the closest mast that I know of and am aware of, and that are in line-of-sight of the house. I don't really think moving would help much, and it's really not feasible for me at the moment. I think readings are reasonably good here, or that's what I've been led to believe from what I've read, and I know what I'm dealing with. If I go somewhere else, who's to say a new mast won't go up, or the neighbours won't have new smart meters put in etc? If a coat of this sheilding paint can basically eliminate a router from behind a wall, and it has broad-spectrum applications, so long as you consider the 'bouncing around' of signals, surely power increases wouldn't make much difference, would they? How much can they possibly continue to turn these things up without getting close to the legal limits (ridiculously high though they are?)

I appreciate what you say Eric, and part of me wonders why I've started on this venture because I don't want it to be futile. Honestly speaking, I must have lived in places that were much, much more exposed than this. I thought that getting rid of the technology myself was enough. Then I was concerned about blocking out the neighbour's Wi-Fi and DECT. Now I'm wondering how much I need to paint to block out the masts. The north wall only? I measured the ceiling and it's about 0.05 V/m, so should I do that too? Then there's the west wall (I'll probably leave the south wall), and then there's the question of the window... if that's not sheilded, will I cause signals to actually increase in the room?

I'm stressed out and at a total loss, and completely freaked out that I've heard, first hand, for the first time, the high-pitched squeal of a phone mast, and that I've been living with that for years and, even worse, dousing myself in radiation from mobile phones, laptops, and Wi-Fi, which have now disappeared or have become wired.

I've been unwell for a very long time and I do wonder whether its sensitivity, or whether it's just me. I did get a card through the door the other day saying that 4G was rolling out into the area and might affect the Freeview because it will be at 800Mhz, and that got me thinking... we are just doused in microwave radiation, and how far should I go at sheilding myself from it, without moving into another (much smaller) bedroom or spending money on painting which might not help or make things worse, and bearing in mind this will only be applicable inside. Outside I'll still be doused in the stuff. I dread taking my meter into a town, I really do. I don't go out much, when I am in places with Wi-Fi after a short period I just feel terrible. Despite the reasonably high readings I think I'm in the best place, except for the one neighbour who, of course, is completely ignorant of these things... but then again I was until just a few months ago. I saw one video of a guy using an acoustimeter on a Wi-Fi router and a mobile phone and within a day both were off.

Without better suggestions, I'm going to think it over but I'll probably paint over the exposed brickwork which I really don't want to do. My family already think I'm mad, and that's the problem. I have had issues with mental health for years and I just wonder if I really am losing it. I now understand why people end up wearing tin hats. Really. Your mind just ends up scrambled. You don't know what to think anymore.

Thank you again for your time and the welcome. I talk a lot. I'm sorry.

ericgeneric
Member
# Posted: 18 Oct 2015 23:18
Reply 


As agnes said, no need to ever apologise!

300m is a lot "safer", that was the original recommded minimum distance between mast towers and humans in the 2000 Stewart Report. I was freaking out a little at the thought you were only 75m away and banking on shielding to stop you from getting sick.

You are doing a lot to ease the EMR load on your system, by ditching the gadgets and the Wi-Fi.

When I am out and about, I often imagine how horrified the public would be if they could all hear the noise this relentless radiation was making around them. Because it's invisible, they simply don't even register its existence. If they could hear it, they would probably think twice about being anywhere near the stuff. I feel it intensely, so I am always aware of exactly what it is wherever I am. Curse? Blessing? Who knows.

EG.

agnes
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 02:07
Reply 


The Lone Ranger.
Tell me if you are in the UK.
If you are, here is a link for you for Aluminum fly screen, that you could HANG on your Lovely Exposed Brickwork wall, so no need to ruin it with paint at all, it would retain its character, the mesh is 66% open, and would all but disappear on the wall, it is 600 mm high, on a 30 meter roll.
Priced at £. 59.99/roll I believe.
Link: http://www.meshdirect.co.uk/aluminium-insect-mesh.html
If you are elsewhere in the world, use this Google results to find where there is "One Near You": https://duckduckgo.com/?q=aluminium+fly+screen+mesh&t=ffhp

You are wondering weather or not you are Electrosensitive or EHS, well on this page we do not really subscribe to EHS, as that is kind of a wastebasket where everything to do with Electricity And Wireless (or Artificial) Microwave Radiation Frequency is dumped in a heap, We call it "Microwave Radiation Poisoning"! and the thing is, in my experience, that if we keep repeating this definition for ever it will Get this definition.

But, you wonder if you are EHS, well, Here is how the the poisoning from wireless microwave radiation affects most of us: Inability to be able to sleep, which can cause unexplained weight gain, although you have totally lost your appetite.
Breakdown of your entire Immune System, which can cause infections, and cause you to catch Any bug "available" near to you, as your immunity is not working.
Everyday headaches, ever noticed (in the local printed press reports) how recently entire populations medical use of sleeping medicine and headache prescriptions have gone up for the the last 20 years (the age of the wireless "Technology" ?
Really serious "Skin Rashes" an I do mean serious, where whenever you come near a mobile or neighbors wi-fi or dect phone you lose the skin of a part of your skin, in my case hands and feet, which then because of your, by now Non-existent Immune System leaves it open for Bacterial, viral and fungal infections, making you trying to work around the clock to try to keep it away, mostly to no avail, as we have No resistance against it anymore.
Tinnitus: A Very serious condition brought on by the Wireless Microwave Radiation Poisoning: Try this out; You are in a job that needs you totally focused on the job on hand, suddenly Tinnitus sets in, there is No Way you can concentrate, the noise is far to loud, you have deep difficulties with hearing what anyone is saying.
And loads more.
These are the serious health effects, I am sorry that I cannot give you a description of the light ones, as I have not experienced them,
But I do know there are some much lighter ones, I just don't know them.
But go on like you have started please!
Microwaves coming in from another direction Do Not Bounce Off shielded walls.
Shielded walls are exactly what they are promoted as, Shielded, anything coming in from outside, will perish on contact.
So, get the fly net, hang it on your North wall, (no-one will be any wiser by it being there)

Look I have felt it all, as Eric said, if you are 300 m away, We (me and my family) were only 28 meters away, so got the whole brunt of it, and now 15 years later are still suffering the total abuse of this "Artificial Technology"
Best regards
Agnes

agnes
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 02:09
Reply 


Kim an Eric.
Thanks for your help here.
All the best
Agnes

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 12:49
Reply 


Thank you so much for your replies, Eric and Agnes.

I couldn't find the 300m recommendation in the 2000 Stewart Report though it makes interesting reading. They don't deny that RF can have biological effects, even though most of the report is centered around minimizing these.

I'm glad I live in an area where I can protect myself from this.

The aluminium fly screen sounds like a really good idea! It's an exposed internal wall, and just so happens to be north facing, which is where the emissions from the mast are coming from. I put up some foil yesterday on the wall, and even that has brought down emissions significantly, by about 60% or thereabouts. My only concern with this mesh is, are the holes 'small enough' to 'catch' the RF, especially the new 4G? I wouldn't want to buy a 30 metre roll of something that doesn't work, but I'm guessing from your experience Agnes that it does actually work and that's why you recommended it. I just want to double check.

I can't believe the symptoms you're experiencing. I have issues with weight gain, and not being able to lose it, but in general it's a feeling of being constantly run down. I know my brother has inexplicable peeling hands, and my mother feels constantly run down too and has been diagnosed with Fibromyalgia. With me, I think the effects have been mostly mental. As I track back over time, problems began when I started having a mobile myself. I never wanted one really, but as a stupid kid I gave into peer pressure and got one. I've only been 'clean' from this technology for a few months so I think it's early days. It's also put paid to me living in a city, where I always feel worse. I always wondered why. It all seems to make a lot of sense now.

I'm wondering when people are going to start waking up. I'm very sensitive physiologically but I'm also quite robust too, which is an odd combination. The problem is, I've never been able to pinpoint exactly what's been going on with me. I think I may be doing that now. I'd just be glad to be able to live and sleep somewhere where there isn't the constant howl from a cellphone tower. With some tweaking, it appears I can do it here. I read about the new 4G signals and because they're at existing frequencies, previous sheilding should still work. My next concern would be smart meters. I'm not having one of those installed, it's been quite a dramatic change giving up all wireless gadgets, and honestly, having been dependent on them for years, I've found the transition hard, though I have to say my mind has, in general been clearer.

I just can't believe what I'm hearing when I turn on the RF meter. I thought the squeal was just normal background noise, but it isn't. It's the sound coming from a cell tower. The best thing is that I don't have next door's Wi-Fi pounding into my head all day every day. Though frankly I seem to be the only person concerned about all this, and as I said, people just seem to think I'm just extra crazy than they already thought I was. Scientists have said that mobile phones etc. will be the smoking gun of the 21st century and I'm inclined to believe them. You can't roll out untested technology en masse. It's beyond ludicrous but that's what's happened. I'd also submit that there is very little benefit to be had from continuous wireless connectivity both in and outside the home, really, and this is especially true if the emissions from these devices are as dangerous as they may well be.

Thanks again for your time and help. Just wanted to confirm about the mesh. But again, any further advice you have is invaluable. I really am out on a limb here and it's taken me a lot of research to come up to speed with the situation. It's also been a slow process. It took me a long time to ditch the mobile phone and I had to do it in stages, but finally did it this summer.

Best wishes to you all. And I hope you can get and stay well.

ericgeneric
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 12:51
Reply 


I couldn't find the 300m recommendation in the 2000 Stewart Report though it makes interesting reading.

Actually I might be mixing things up, there was a Canadian (?) report in the 90s which recommended the minimum distance for houses/schools etc should be 300m. I always remember the figure because it's three times the distance that our mast is from the house.

EG.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 13:43
Reply 


Hi EG,

Wasn't meaning to seem pedantic. I would be interested to try and find the report that actually stipulated 300m. I guess I'm lucky that I am 300m away as the crow flies.

You know the other terrible thing is that mast locations aren't even published anymore. I think it's scandalous.

How did you resolve your issues ultimately? Did you move?

I think it is inconceivable that pulsed microwaves would have no effect on a human being. They are bound to have an effect. We are 'frequency' after all, we are 'electric', and I cannot see how allowing untested spectrums of microwaves to be used on the general public in any way acceptable. I worry about kids now. At least I knew a time before these new phone masts... I think. When I was a kid, mobile phones were very fancy things. I first knew of one at 11 and had my own one at 14. In many ways I wish I never had.

I suffer from paranoia a lot and sometimes I wonder whether I'm being paranoid about this, but when I speak to others who have encountered difficulties (and much worse than myself) then I start to think that maybe I am right in being concerned about this, before it's too late.

Thanks again. Any advice is greatly appreciated. It really is.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 14:02
Reply 


Agnes,

They no longer sell the mesh that you recommended. Such a shame. I called up and they don't stock it anymore because no one bought it.

Thanks for the suggestion anyway. I really think I'm going to have to paint the wall though I really, really, really don't want to, as mesh is not cheap either. Nothing is cheap when it comes to this, and I can't live with foil on the walls!

Thanks again.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 14:07
Reply 


Sorry for all the messages.

Would something like this be any good, do you think?

http://www.meshdirect.co.uk/black-woven-aluminium-fly-insect-screen.html

It is black... does the epoxy resin make any difference to its effectiveness?

Thank you.

horsevad
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 15:29
Reply 


The aluminium fly screen sounds like a really good idea! It's an exposed internal wall, and just so happens to be north facing, which is where the emissions from the mast are coming from. I put up some foil yesterday on the wall, and even that has brought down emissions significantly, by about 60% or thereabouts. My only concern with this mesh is, are the holes 'small enough' to 'catch' the RF, especially the new 4G? I wouldn't want to buy a 30 metre roll of something that doesn't work, but I'm guessing from your experience Agnes that it does actually work and that's why you recommended it. I just want to double check.



Even though the 800MHz band allows the radiation to penetrate further than shorter wavelengths it will at the same time make it easier to shield.

The mesh size of a faraday cage can be calculated by viewing each individual mesh as a waveguide. For normal use a mesh size of 1/20 wavelength is considered adequate. For EHS use I usually recommend a mesh size of 1/40 wavelenght in order to achieve a more efficient shielding.

For 800MHz (LTE / 4G) the wavelength is 37.5 cm. 1/40 of this is 9,3mm.
For 2.5GHz WiFi the wavelenght is 12.5cm. 1/40 of this is 3.1mm.

Fairly normal fly netting from commercial sources will therefore be fully adequate for shielding purposes.

//Kim Horsevad

horsevad
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 15:33
Reply 


Quote
Sorry for all the messages.

Would something like this be any good, do you think?

http://www.meshdirect.co.uk/black-woven-aluminium-fly-insect-screen.html


Yes, that would be fine for the purpose, although similar products can be found much cheaper.

---

It is black... does the epoxy resin make any difference to its effectiveness?


No, the important thing is that the underlying material (aluminium) is electrically conductive. It will, however, make it somewhat more difficult to achieve a sufficient grounding.

//Kim Horsevad

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 15:45
Reply 


Thank you so much Kim.

I'm still looking for cheaper mesh. Now I know that the 'holes' don't need to be exceptionally small to have an effect, then I'm sure I can find cheaper.

You've all been such amazing help. I can't thank you enough. I hope that I will be able to return the help at some point.

Many thanks once again. All suggestions and advice are greatly appreciated.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 16:05
Reply 


Any suggestions for cheap, appropriate mesh for purchase in the UK would be greatly appreciated, as I can't find any that are cheaper.

Thank you.

ericgeneric
Member
# Posted: 19 Oct 2015 21:12
Reply 


Hi EG,Wasn't meaning to seem pedantic. I would be interested to try and find the report that actually stipulated 300m. I guess I'm lucky that I am 300m away as the crow flies.

Oh, I didn't take it as being pedantic, no worries. And I'd like to find that report again myself...I've accumulated so much literature and pdf files over the past 8 years. It's a jungle sometimes.

EG.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 20 Oct 2015 11:21
Reply 


Just wanted to give an update.

I searched... and searched... and searched for reasonably priced aluminium fly mesh, insect mesh, whatever you call it, all to no avail. In the end, I've purchased mesh, but it's 1/4" which I think is going to be a bit too big for any use. Plus, I just don't know whether I'm going to make the room look like a prison/chicken run with mesh on the walls. My family thinks I've lost it. The interior exposed brickwork is beautiful but uneven (different sized stones etc.) and I'm being strongly, strongly encouraged not to paint it. But that's the wall in the direction of the mobile masts, the beams of which seem to be hitting me head on, probably at a distance of 500+ metres or so, but with a strength (outside the window) of 0.2 V/m. Now to most I'm sure this sounds like nothing. But when you read reports of biological effects starting at at least 0.05 V/m, you start to worry.

I mean... Even if I shield this room, I still have to go out. If it's this bad where I live, I can't imagine what it's like in a city. I know I'm becoming more sensitive to these things as time is going on and as I've been reading, it's a one-way street. Once you're sensitive that's it. I'd just quite like to sleep in a room where the rf meter is as close to silent as possible. I thought the neighbour's Wi-Fi and DECT were the biggest problems. I was wrong.

Is 6mm mesh realistically going to do much? According to Kim's numbers, it should cover 800MHz but not do much for 2.8 GHz and will be significantly worse for anything over that. Plus I think it's going to look faintly ridiculous.

I'm so frazzled over all this because, despite being able to work a lot of this stuff out, it's easy to make things worse rather than better. Even if I cover the wall I'll need to screen the window and I'm wondering, really, whether this is all worth it for levels that, indoors, are never more than 0.1 V/m. But the sounds on the rf meter are horrific sometimes, even at much lower strengths than that.

Thanks again.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 20 Oct 2015 11:32
Reply 


Correction.

I can't be sure it's from the 500m mast alone. There's a 300m mast, a 350m (ish) mast, and a 500m mast. I can see the last two, the closest one is obscured out of sight. So, I shouldn't be saying 'its that mast etc.) because really I don't know.

And that's the problem. I'm pretty out of my depth here. And I just find it amazing, absolutely amazing, that the rf readings are strongest in bedrooms! Geez! It's almost like it's intentional, though I think that's highly unlikely.

You see the world in a completely different way when you've got an rf meter with audio. I can't look out the window in the same way anymore, because I can still 'hear' the sounds I heard when the meter was on. And I've always got a low-level of singing in the ears. God knows where that came from.

Thanks for all your time and help.

Henrik
Admin
# Posted: 20 Oct 2015 14:52
Reply 


theloneranger,

Put most effort into shielding your sleeping space. Your body can handle more exposure during the daytime if you get proper sleep. Sleep is key to a well functioning immune system.

Also, get enough anti-oxidants through your diet. Preferably from natural sources.
Vitamins C & E have been shown, in animal studies, to protect against the brunt of the oxidative stress that microwave exposure causes. Humans can't produce vitamin C internally, like most animals can, so the fact that the animals in the studies needed supplements to protect against DNA-damage from microwave exposure is telling a lot.

During sleep the body produces Melatonin, a hormone that also doubles as a super-antioxidant and free radical scavenger.

A lot of your Melatonin is produced in the gut so maintaining gut health is vital to your immune system. A cheap and easy way to promote gut health is to make your own sauerkraut (fermented cabbage). Sauerkraut contains loads of beneficial bacteria for the gut and it also supplies vitamins.
See here for an overview of health benefits:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sauerkraut#Health_effects
and here for recipe:
http://www.wildfermentation.com/category/sauerkrautrecipes/

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 20 Oct 2015 16:31
Reply 


Dear Henrik,

Thank you for all your helpful suggestions. They're greatly appreciated.

I knew that melatonin was important though I've not had much luck with taking the supplements in the past. Likewise with vitamins, the best sources are natural sources.

I've never even tried sauerkraut so I'll have to give that a go too!

It's quite scary when you realise what's going on, and it's good to know I'm not the only one out there. Though I am thankful, as yet, that perhaps I haven't been affected physically (though I may well have been affected in other ways) by mobile masts, Wi-Fi, DECT, and the general electrosmog that we are now living in. What makes it worse is the general level of misinformation, perhaps inadvertent, perhaps deliberate, that exists out there.

I think things started to change when I realised that, I didn't really *need* Wi-Fi, or smartphones, or gadgets like that, and the supposed benefits of these technologies hadn't really manifested themselves. Then came the big shock - having these waves brought into consciousness by hearing them for the first time - hearing something that had, until now, basically been completely invisible and might as well not have existed. It's taken a long time to get to where I am now, it's been in stages, and it's been a slow process, but I'm grateful for all the help and that I've gotten along the way. Maybe a lot of my troubles can be attributed to years and years of frying myself with microwave technologies, albeit unwittingly, and I'd just say that I'm sorry for having 'fried' those around me with Wi-Fi, mobiles, and the rest. I really didn't know what I was doing - and this is the thing - these neighbours etc get on our nerves when we realise what's happening, but the thing is, they really don't, and as one post on this forum suggested, they may just not be able to take in all the information and process it.

I'm sure it was like this with smoking in the early days. I'm sure a lot of people couldn't process that it could do so much damage, which seems perverse now as we all seem to understand that breathing in smoke is at best a highly questionable activity and unlikely to be heath promoting in the slightest. But we know that with hindsight. Until then, as far as wireless technology goes, the ability to communicate with anyone in the world 24/7, and not just through voice calls and texts but with multimedia, and share that multimedia over social networking is an extremely strong psychological pull to people who are able to create a cognitive dissonance regarding microwaves. After all, they heat many people's food (not mine anymore!) and don't get immediately sick, so they question how something that, although still microwaves but purportedly at much lower doses, could do anything harmful. But they don't know about the pulsing, they don't know about the difference, and then there's the latency as there was with smoking. Everyone knows one cigarette isn't going to kill you there and then, just as using a mobile for a few minutes doesn't (though many get headaches and worse, and when I first started using phones I got headaches and was laughed at. I wish I'd listened to my body back then). But it's the cumulative damage to those who are unaware as they are insensitive to it, or not sensitive to it yet. I think that the 'time lag' is rapidly catching up with people. I'm shocked at the stories I hear of young people dying from terminal illnesses or just dropping dead, in this 'modern world' it doesn't make sense. And as another poster pointed out, the idea pushed about by some 'experts' that cancer is down to 'misfortune' and you can't do anything about it is ridiculous.

Something is going seriously wrong with society and I think a lot of people are increasingly aware of it.

Take care.

Thank you to you all.

vjc13
# Posted: 18 Feb 2016 09:58
Reply 


Hi - I have just come across this post I have managed to get our measurements of R/F down but have a constant 0.05v/m in my little ones bed, my partner says its sooo small and to stop stressing but I am really worried - can anyone help?

vjc13
# Posted: 18 Feb 2016 15:33
Reply 


Lone ranger - is it 0.10 or 0.01 you are measuring? both are very low esp when you compare to what most of the world is experiencing.

i have tried to block out every signal - you cant do it

we have only shielded one of our walls with the bloc paint( the one against our neighbours lounge where there wifi box is) like you i was worried about compounding the problem and making it worse.

we have been exposed to rf probably all our lives in some form, the newest thing is wifi in the home and smart phones - if you can block them and you seem to be doing well with the masts blocking then you are doing pretty good.

this issue took over my life and to an extent it still is - i want to protect my child but i have to accept i can only do what i can and i know that as far as rf goes his exposure in my house is far less than most kids.

i dread to think what he thinks about me running around with an accoustimtere.

theloneranger
Member
# Posted: 11 May 2016 00:41 - Edited by: theloneranger
Reply 


Hello!

Apologies for not having been active recently!

Thanks for the comments vjc13 (gets out cornet to check V/m in room... I tend to work in mW/m2 now...)

The highest peaks I get are 0.06 odd... but generally I'm down around 0.02 ish or thereabouts. This is only in the front two bedrooms and the hallway. This is all coming from two masts in line of sight in town. Fabulous luck.

The radiation comes in through the window, especially when open (good double glazing is not bad at reducing radiation in some respects, from my experience, but don't expect miracles) but a lot comes through the walls, which are thick anyway. As I say, I painted the wall that connects to my neighbour, where he has a DECT phone, WiFi... and he wonders why he's ill when all this is in his bedroom! Another family member has experienced much greater symptoms since she had a WiMax router installed (working at around 5 ish GHz) and I have gently pressed the issue but it's like saying your illness is caused by 'wicked spells'.... that's the look I got anyway.

I digress. For me the issue is damage reduction. I should probably post another thread for this, but I've found that SOME smartphones, when only used for calls and texts, NOT internet, emit lower radiation levels than the older, brick-style phones. I, by coincidence, had a Galaxy Note II. It happens to be one of the lowest emitters of radiation... this does not apply if you use it for WiFi, and certainly not for 3G. The meter then howls... From my experience, radiation levels are much lower when WCDMA is used rather than GSM. A lot of the old brick phones use GSM exclusively. I urge you to learn to listen to the difference between the types of radiation (TETRA I find the most alarming, and the poor emergency services have those things strapped to their chest!)

I have severely limited the use of WiFi in the house by purchasing a router with a WiFi on/off button (because some family members can only go with me so far, though I genuinely FEEL different if some inconsiderate/unenlightened individual leaves the router on all night...) and I only use my mobile for emergencies. It has taken quite some time to adjust, and for others to adjust to my new way of living. There is an element of increased social isolation but to be honest, it's just like living in the early 1990s, except with super-fast wired internet available and a mobile if I really need it (car breaks down in middle of nowhere, I fall off a cliff etc.). I think it would be very difficult to completely do away with a mobile phone, especially since many phone boxes are now being removed.

I think that, because there is such a lack of understanding of the dangers of radiation, the best thing we can do is 'play it cool'. I know many of us want to shout from the rooftops about the dangers, but then we just get called cranks, so it doesn't work. I know I wanted to shout from the rooftops when I first realized how dangerous this untested technology can be. Religious or not, I like the passage in Proverbs 15:1 "A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger." It's related to cognitive dissonance. The idea that phones, WiFi etc can be dangerous is just so unbelievable to people that they simply cannot accept the idea. I think that, from my experience, gentle, persistent but not insistent prodding is the only way to go. If they're ready for it, switch the sound on on the meter. That certainly made some members of my family think twice. Some just went 'meh'.

I compare our current situation to the situation with smoking/cigarettes in the 1930s or so. There are people like us sounding warnings, but no one really gives a damn and just as unbelievable as it was back then that inhaling smoke in your lungs could be bad for you, people simply can't accept that consistent, pulsing doses of low-power radiation can be exceptionally damaging. As with smoking, the damage occurs so slowly, so imperceptibly sometimes, that people don't attribute it to the radiation.

I must admit that as time has gone on, I've chilled out a bit about the situation, though coming back here has stirred me up again somewhat. I, like you all, genuinely have grave concerns about this use of technology and I just wonder how best to get our message across - because people aren't listening... or at least not many. You guys certainly helped me listen.

Keep going vjc13, and I will post more often. I'm sorry I've been away, I missed you guys.

TLR

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